For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Cheap!)

Kayak fishing equipment and rigging discussion.

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cestevespr
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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by cestevespr » Sat Nov 03, 2012 12:58 pm

I definitely like the modifications though I am concerned about bolting through my canoe because it is fiberglass. By chance do you know if I have to do anything different if it is fiberglass as oppose to plastic?

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internetpilot
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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by internetpilot » Sun Nov 04, 2012 10:54 am

Not a fiberglass expert by any means, but I wouldn't hesitate to attach fishing rod holders or other minor things with bolts through a fiberglass hull. Just like with plastic (or even aluminum) make sure you don't over-tighten the fasteners so you don't crack the hull.

One thing I've seen the kayakers talk about using for a back plate is a plastic cutting board. You could cut that to whatever size strip you need and it would help with reducing the stress the fiberglass (or plastic, too) when bolting through it.

I don't know if I'd attach a seat modification to the fiberglass hull unless that already was the point of attachment for the stock seats. The best method for a seat would probably be the gunwale. That's what I would've done with my plastic canoe except that I wasn't 100% positive I was going to stick with the seat mod if/when I made it a solo fishing canoe. Turns out that I didn't stick with it, so I'm glad I didn't drill into my gunwale and just used the existing seat mounting holes in the sides of the canoe. You may want to search for Crusher's thread to see what he did with his canoe. He used a piece of sheet metal and attached it to the gunwale to serve as a platform for a swivel seat.

I'm putting an anchor trolly back on my canoe. I had one previously, but didn't like it at all so I removed it. Turned out that some trollies are better than others, design-wise. The one I have now doesn't stretch out so far from the side of the boat due to a zigzag cleat, so I'm thinking this one will work better for me. I'm still not using a stakeout pole because my outriggers would interfere too much with it, but I think it will work well with my grapple anchor, especially when I'm fishing solo.
Last edited by internetpilot on Sun Mar 03, 2013 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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idratherbefishing
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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by idratherbefishing » Tue Feb 05, 2013 10:20 pm

I have a coleman scanoe like yours. I'm just beginning to rig it as well. Please email me I have some questions about your rigging. Thanks.

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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by internetpilot » Wed Feb 06, 2013 7:55 pm

idratherbefishing wrote:I have a coleman scanoe like yours. I'm just beginning to rig it as well. Please email me I have some questions about your rigging. Thanks.
idratherbefishing wrote:Hey man I bought a 2012 coleman scanoe. It's just like yours but i have the green colored one. I'm using it for fishing only. I've been using the back seat for fishing so I can use the trolling motor to get in and out of places I want to go. I'm wanting to put a seat on the back like yours but I have no clue how to do it. Can you show me exactly what materials you used to help me out? How did you saw your wood to match the curved angle? I have no tools like that so I'm starting to wonder if I can do this. I'm also wanting to make some kind of center console like you did with your thwart. If you can give me step by step info and possibly more pictures I'd love to do this to mine. Let me know if you can help. Do you get a lot better fishing angle when the raised seat?
I'm keeping this on the public forum to hopefully help out current and future Scanoe owners who may find this thread via a Google search or something.

When I initially installed my thwart (and then that rear swivel seat), I was thinking about the Scanoe the same way you are -- making the mounts and everything to fit the boat. You still have to do that to some extent, but you also need to realize that this is a plastic canoe which makes it rather flexible and very forgiving. In other words, make your mounts roughly to the shape/dimensions of the canoe, but then canoe will flex and forgive any minor fit issues.

For the rear seat frame (see pic below), I just used 2"x2" boards. Since I was going to paint it anyway, I didn't use treated lumber which is typically rougher and warped. I did use a higher quality wood -- can't remember what it was, but it wasn't pine although it was just a like maybe $1 more than pine for a 6' piece. I made the frame like this because I didn't want to put additional holes in my canoe hull -- at least not until I determined that this would work and I wanted to keep it this way. So I just used the two holes that were already there on each side from the stock seat. The two side pieces are miter cut at a weird angle, but I made that cut by eye only after installing the front and rear cross pieces. Honestly, you don't have to do that -- I mainly did it for looks. Once you install the two side pieces to the hull using the existing two holes on each side from the stock seats, just measure out the two cross pieces and eyeball the cut with even a manual saw. Again, the canoe will flex in and out easily as much as an inch (more if you apply more force), so it's very forgiving of bad measuring and/or cuts.

What I would advise (because it's what I did) is attaching the two boards on the side first. You'll have to get longer bolts/nuts -- they have them at Home Depot, just make sure you get the stainless steel ones. The bolts don't need to be much longer than the boards -- the hull on the Scanoe is probably only like 1/8" thick. Then measure either the front or back cross piece, cut it, install it, and THEN measure, cut and install the remaining cross piece. If you try to cut both of them at the same time or build the whole frame outside of the canoe, you're going to end up with something being too short or too long. For joining the 2"x2" frame together, I just used some deck screws that I already had. You don't have to go stainless on these, since they're already relatively water/weather resistant since they're made for using on outdoor decks.

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For the top of the bench, I just went to Home Depot and near their big rip saw in the lumber department they almost always have some really nice hardwood remnants for cheap $. I wanted that bench to be a really good piece of wood for strength and durability since it was going to be holding my 240lbs. I think I ended up with oak, and I think the hull of the boat would fail before that bench would. I simply measured the front and back of the space above the 2"x2" frame and cut the bench at the angle on each side. I attached the bench to the 2"x2" frame with shorter deck screws.

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Now the swivel mechanism is up to you. I went with this type:

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instead of this type:

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because the pin-based one is easier to remove the seat for transporting the canoe. There also aren't any bearings to corrode, etc. You can get a quick release bracket for the other type of swivel design, too, but I couldn't find one that would fit the swivel that would fit my chair.

The chair type is also your choice.

If you look at the finished product in the pic below, you'll see that there's a piece of PVC sewer pipe under the bench with my cutting board as a base. That's because unlike the original stock bench, my bench didn't rest on the bottom of the hull so when I would sit in the canoe, the sides would significantly flex in/out. The reason why Coleman (actually KL Industries) makes those stock bench seats like that is so (1) the passenger weight isn't solely on the sides of the canoe and (2) To push the bottom of the hull down when out on the water (so the boat doesn't try to turn inside out). Remember #2 if you get the idea to remove all the stock seats and replace them with old fashion cane weave benches or something. That would probably be bad. Anyway, the sewer pipe was just a quick and dirty support solution -- you could do the same thing with 2"x4" or something if you wanted to do something more permanent. It also might be nice to build like a little cupboard under there with shelves/slots for Plano boxes, etc.

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I made the thwart the same basic way I did the bench (actually did the thwart first). I used two pieces of 1"x3" plank as mounts on the side of the hull, then used a 1"x2" as cross piece, and then put a 1"x3" plank across the top. The plank across the top would've flexed a lot (probably break) without the 1"x2" under it -- I can now lean all my weight on the thwart and it doesn't move. The only reason I installed a thwart was for stabilizer pontoons. I originally decided on the pontoons for the peace of mind of my two young fishing partners, but now that I mostly solo fish, I'm really appreciating these pontoons for being able to stand up and fish.

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So, you really don't need any special tools or even be all that crafty to do any of this.

HOWEVER, *FOR THIS PARTICULAR CANOE*, I would only advise you doing this seat mod if you also put some outrigger stabilizers on your Scanoe like I have. If you're fishing by yourself, and sitting that high up in this particular canoe, you're probably going to roll it. When I fished with this seat, I had my two sons with me (together about 150lbs), a really big trolling motor battery, one of the heavier trolling motors on the market (54# thrust and and a stainless steel shaft), probably about 50-75lbs of other gear, and it was "okay" in terms of stability. I did find myself depending on the stabilizers a lot. Without the extra weight of the boys and their gear, I don't think the center of gravity is low enough in the canoe to safely use this seat mod (without the pontoon stabilizers).

All this being said, for fishing by myself, I've now moved on to this configuration:

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I know, I know...the lawn chair... :shock: :roll: :oops: haha. But you know what, it works GREAT, it's very portable, light weight, comfortable, and was only $15 at Wal-Mart. I pilot the boat, do some fishing, and trolling from the stock rear seat, when I get to a good stopping spot I drop anchor, stand up, turn around, and sit in the lawn chair (which is why the chair is facing backwards). A benefit of the rear facing chair is that I can push the bow of the canoe up on land or in the reeds, leave the trolling motor down, and then cast out toward the open, deeper water, reeling into shallow water. I know it ain't pretty, but I usually have the philosophy of going with whatever works, and this works and works well.

But I'm not done modding the Scanoe -- I'm in the process now of converting my Scanoe into a poor man's motorized Wilderness Commander or Native Ultimate. Eventually, I'll be sitting in the middle of the canoe just like in the Commander/Ultimate kayaks, probably using a kayak wedge style seat on top of the stock bench. I already extended the length of my kayak paddle to about 9.5' to account for the wider hull of the Scanoe, so I can go motorless if I ever want to (or need to if I decide to get crazy and participate in a fishing tournament or something). I have a super long tiller extension for my motor that has a U-joint on it so I can easily steer and throttle the trolling motor from the middle seat while it's installed on the stern. That tiller extensions is normally 1/2 the price of a good trolling motor, but I found it online open-box for 1/3 of the normal ridiculous price. I'm also going to move the outrigger stabilizers toward the bow or the stern so they're not in the way of me paddling in the middle seat. The only problem with this configuration that I have yet to resolve is being able to remotely lift the trolling motor out of the water from the middle seat. The problem is actually my trolling motor, because unlike the Minn Kota motors that have a lift lever to tilt the motor out of the water, the Watersnake motor that I have has a push lever. I can rig up a simple string to activate the lever to get the motor out of the water, but I can't use that same design to activate the lever to get the motor back in the water -- I'd have to climb to the back, push the lever, and lower the motor. The important part is to be able to get the motor out of the water quickly (in case of surprise oyster beds, shallows, etc.), so this isn't a show stopper, but it's a bit inconvenient to put the motor back down. I think when this motor dies, I'll likely get a Minn Kota motor since it's easier to devise a remote lift system for those.

Well, that's a bit more info on my Scanoe seat mod, as well as a current status of my continuous fishing Scanoe project. I hope the info helps, and please feel free to ask more questions. There are more Scanoe owners here on these forums, and quite a few other canoe owners/paddlers. Plus, you'll find that a lot of the kayak rigging can also be used on the Scanoe, sometimes straight up or with a little bit of modification.
Last edited by internetpilot on Thu Feb 07, 2013 6:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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idratherbefishing
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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by idratherbefishing » Wed Feb 06, 2013 9:22 pm

Thanks for the advice. I wanted to do that seat mod but you said it might not be stable without stabilizers. I'm not sure if I want to try that mod then. My problem with sitting in the middle seat is that I'm constantly using the trolling motor forward and backward to get the spot I want to fish. It's mostly due to the wind blowing me around so I got to constantly keep it where I want unless I drop an anchor and sit fish the area. You said you use one of those very long extender arms for the motor. I have a 2 foot extender. The problem I'm having with my extender is that I have the 55lb thrust like you have and the extender handle sometimes doesn't work that good, you turn it to one speed, but it might skip to the next speed or vice versa. The longer the extender arm the more stress on the trolling motor and harder to turn into the speed setting u want to use too. This summer I might just try it different ways like you do and see how it works. I'm thinking about adding a couple railblaza ports and a couple pole holders too. I'm thinking about getting a anchor trolley kit. I'm not sure if anyone has a trolley kit and how well they work. Maybe someone can enlighten me if they are worth installing.

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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by internetpilot » Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:30 pm

idratherbefishing wrote:Thanks for the advice. I wanted to do that seat mod but you said it might not be stable without stabilizers. I'm not sure if I want to try that mod then.
I have to be honest with you -- without the stabilizers, I probably would've moved on to another boat by now (probably a kayak for 3x the $). I have a bad back and neck, and I'm also a pretty big guy (6'3", +/- 240lbs) -- if I couldn't stand up and fish or just move around or sit higher up like I do in my ol' lawn chair, I'd probably only go fishing 2 or 3 times a year. The stabilizers make this canoe like a floating dock. I can actually stand up and fish easily and even stay standing while motoring around with the trolling motor on full speed. They look a little goofy (I call them training wheels), and they are just one more thing to lug around and deal with at the launch when coming and going, but until (if) I get another boat that I can so easily stand up in, I'll be using the training wheels.
idratherbefishing wrote:My problem with sitting in the middle seat is that I'm constantly using the trolling motor forward and backward to get the spot I want to fish. It's mostly due to the wind blowing me around so I got to constantly keep it where I want unless I drop an anchor and sit fish the area.
I had the same problem before I started using an anchor and/or a stake-out pole (frequently referred to as "SOP" here on the forum).
You and I have this problem more than most because...yep...we're sitting in the rear most seat of the canoe. This puts the bow up higher in the air and allows the canoe to get blown around more. Getting that bow lower in the water (either by putting balast up front or sitting in the middle seat) will significant reduce how much you're blown around.

idratherbefishing wrote:You said you use one of those very long extender arms for the motor. I have a 2 foot extender. The problem I'm having with my extender is that I have the 55lb thrust like you have and the extender handle sometimes doesn't work that good, you turn it to one speed, but it might skip to the next speed or vice versa. The longer the extender arm the more stress on the trolling motor and harder to turn into the speed setting u want to use too.
This is the tiller extension I have:
Image
It extends from 37" to 51", but I already adapted it to be extendable to a full 6 feet. The universal joint on it makes it very different from most other extensions -- you use a push/pull method to steer, and I find it really easy to turn the speed setting accurately just one click in either direction, even when steering a turn.
idratherbefishing wrote:I'm thinking about getting a anchor trolley kit. I'm not sure if anyone has a trolley kit and how well they work. Maybe someone can enlighten me if they are worth installing.
I actually have one on my Scanoe. I bought THIS ONE as recommended by several other forum members, and it's a very nice, quality trolley. I used to just always anchor from the stern and deal with whichever way the wind or current would point me, but now I can make sure that I'm facing the right/best direction (in my rear-facing lawn chair -- haha). Very easy to install and even easier to operate.

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-- Chris :thumbleft:
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JoRo
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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by JoRo » Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:50 pm

Wow. Thank you so much for sharing. I am running out to rig my Mohawk like this. Its exactly what I was looking for. I realize this thread is older, but if you are still offering advice, what is the base you are using to attach the outrigger to the thwart? Any help is greatly appreciated!
:salute:

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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by internetpilot » Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:08 pm

Thanks for the praise. I really enjoyed rigging it and enjoy using it even more. As the smallest craft that can hold me and my two boys, it has proven priceless even though it was also one of the cheapest routes.

I used the regular Scotty deck/side combo mount that comes with most of their gear. If I just used a 2x4 or even 1x4 for the thwart I might have chosen the flush Mount so it would be more out of the way when hauling the canoe upside down, but I needed to use a T-beam style thwart for strength since my canoe is kinda wimpy.

Be careful! I'm spoiled by my canoe and having a lot of trouble finding a kayak because of it due to room, stability, convenience, weight, capacity, etc.!
-- Chris :thumbleft:
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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by JoRo » Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:34 pm

I figured it was Scotty mount, I guess what I was really asking is what is the holder that is attached to the mount, that is holding the PVC? I tried looking for the holder through Scotty and Attwood and could not find anything similiar. I am excited about this project, even going all out to add some lacing for attachment by carabiner... Thank you so much for your rsponse. :salute:

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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by internetpilot » Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:05 pm

Oops -- sorry. It's a Scotty Rodmaster II rod holder. Here's another post where I explained them more thoroughly:

topic27022-15.html#p211081

I drilled holes through the Rodmasters and PVC and then put a wire clamp hitch pin through the whole thing to hold the outriggers in the Rodmasters. I drilled several holes in the PVC pipe at like 1 inch increments so that in addition to adjusting the angle of the outriggers with the Rodmaster gears I can adjust the length of the outriggers out a few inches, too.

I decided on the length of the outriggers by just putting the canoe and outriggers on the ground, which works out perfect on the water too.

If you have any questions at all, just post them here so everyone can benefit or if you want you can just PM me.

The only thing I regret about rigging my canoe is that I'm now pretty much done so I'm bored. Haha.
-- Chris :thumbleft:
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JoRo
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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by JoRo » Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:56 am

Thank you so much for the help! I'll post pictures when I get rigged up :salute: !

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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by BlindSquirrel » Sat Apr 13, 2013 8:51 am

You have got a great looking setup there. I may use a lot of those ideas. I do have one question about square back canoes in general though. Don't you find that you have to either reach behind you or twist around to use the motor? I have a flatstalker and I wind up sitting sideways. It doesn't look like you could do that with your canoe. I'm looking to move to a canoe, and the scanoe was on my short list until that thought occured to me. At least with a traditional canoe, you generall offset the motor when you mount it.

Thanks,
mikeg

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internetpilot
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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by internetpilot » Sat Apr 13, 2013 10:51 pm

Thanks! The motor mount is pretty far back, but with the trolling motor's slide out tiller, I can just reach it while sitting forward. I frequently use the tiller extension with the universal joint and it actually is too long when adjusted at the maximum length.
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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by Grouper » Sun Jun 23, 2013 11:51 pm

Hi ,Internetpilot,Thank you very much for sharing your stabilizer,I was made one like yours :lol

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Re: For Canoe Folks -- Rigging a Canoe for Fishing (Done Che

Post by internetpilot » Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:39 pm

Grouper wrote:Hi ,Internetpilot,Thank you very much for sharing your stabilizer,I was made one like yours :lol
Hey, no problem -- that's exactly why I shared it! I hope they work for you as well as they have for me! Mine are still going strong with no problems and I don't see anything changing that anytime soon.

By the way, I now have all four of my floats with the point facing forward. I figured I didn't go backwards enough for it to really matter, and now there's a lot less drag going forward now, especially when going at higher speeds.
-- Chris :thumbleft:
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Coleman Scanoe
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Field & Stream Shadow Caster 123

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